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RE: [SURBL-Discuss] And away we go!
by Chris Santerre 22 Apr '04

22 Apr '04

> -----Original Message----- > From: David Coulson [mailto:david@davidcoulson.net] > Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 9:38 AM > To: SURBL Discussion list > Subject: Re: [SURBL-Discuss] And away we go! > > > SpamCopURI stats for one domain here for this morning. > > Total: 33024 > SC 22090 > WS 19029 > BE 3597 > > On a similar note, Spamhaus' XBL got hit 23847 times which is pretty > impressive. > > David > And BE will ALWAYS be lower...Why? I use RBLs at the MTA level :) I knew it would effect my file, but I couldn't let the company take a hit for BigEvil sake. --Chris

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Trouble installing SpamCopURI
by Bo Stark 22 Apr '04

22 Apr '04

I get "Can't locate Mail/SpamAssassin.pm in @INC" error msg then I run perl Makefile.PL. Do I need root access? Because I don't have that. Also Im not running SpamAssassin as spamd. Is it possible to install anyway? b.

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[SURBL-Discuss] RE: [SURBL-Announce] ANNOUNCE: BigEvil.cf and MidEvil.cf are now available in SURBL formas be.surbl.org
by Scott Truman 22 Apr '04

22 Apr '04

> BigEvil.cf and MidEvil.cf are now available in SURBL form as > be.surbl.org, for use with SpamCopURI SpamAssassin 2.63 and > URIDNSBL SpamAssassin 3.0 plugins. Thanks Chris, Paul and > Gary Funck! > > Here's an excerpt about the new list from the Quick Start > section: > > > http://www.surbl.org/ > > Chris Santerre and Paul Barbeau's BigEvil and MidEvil > SpamAssassin rules are now available as an SURBL for use with > plugins and programs such as those mentioned above which can > extract message body URI domains and compare them against > name-based RBLs. The name of the list is be.surbl.org, and some > sample rules and scores to use it appears below. The well-known > and popular BigEvil and MidEvil SA rulesets are used to block > messages based on domains that have occurred in spam message body > URIs. Using this as an SURBL instead allows you to remove this > relatively large ruleset from SA memory and lets DNS cache the > data in a zone file instead, querying SURBL hits from DNS as > needed. > > An SA 2.63 rule and score using SpamCopURI (but not the SpamCop > data!) looks like this: > > uri BE_URI_RBL > eval:check_spamcop_uri_rbl('be.surbl.org','127.0.0.2') > describe BE_URI_RBL URI's domain appears in BigEvil > tflags BE_URI_RBL net > > score BE_URI_RBL 3.0 > > An SA 3.0 rule and score using URIBL's urirhsbl looks like this: > > urirhsbl URIBL_BE_SURBL be.surbl.org. A > header URIBL_BE_SURBL eval:check_uridnsbl('URIBL_BE_SURBL') > describe URIBL_BE_SURBL Contains a URL listed BigEvil > tflags URIBL_BE_SURBL net > > score URIBL_BE_SURBL 3.0 > > be.surbl.org can be used alone or with other SURBL lists; all > that's needed are different rule and score names, as we've shown > in the samples. More information about be.surbl.org can be found > in the Additional SURBLs section. > > http://www.surbl.org/additional.html > > > be.surbl.org joins Bill Stearns' sa-blacklist-based ws.surbl.org > and my own SpamCop URI-based sc.surbl.org SURBLs. All are > described more at the site. > > Please send me any questions, comments, corrections, updates, > etc. > > Cheers, > > Jeff C. > > P.S. We will probably offer a combined list at some point. > We're still working out the details of that. Until then it's > quite possible to use one or more of the lists simply by using > separate SA rules for each one that you want to use, as shown > in the Quick Start samples. > > P.P.S. The sample rules have been updated to mention "SpamCop" > only in the descriptions of rules that actually use SpamCop data. > -- > Jeff Chan Hi, You seem to put a lot of emphasis on the memory taken up by these two lists in memory. When I removed them, spamd's memory utilisation went down only 1.9MB (down from 33.5MB to 31.6MB). Now unless you are really strapped for memory, I don't see this as a great advantage. What's quicker execution-wise...a regex of the list in memory, or a DNS lookup/eval...I would imagine the later, but does anybody know? The obvious advantage is that one doesn't have to update the cf files manually. What's the TTL for entries in this database? Cheers Scott

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Re: [SURBL-Discuss] BigEvil + MidEvil as SURBL
by Jeff Chan 22 Apr '04

22 Apr '04

[Update, Chris wrote off list that he's put up a quick be.htm page to be prettified later.] On Wednesday, April 21, 2004, 7:36:08 AM, Chris Santerre wrote: >> Sounds good. Can you let me know what kind of TTL I should set? > Well I am now trying to update at least every other day. This way I won't > fall behind. But I'm now getting every day. I always test overnight, because > too many people rely on the list now. I usually post before noon EST. OK sounds like an 8 or 12 hour TTL is appropriate then; setting to 8 now. Any idea how often Paul updates MidEvil? >> Basically I'd like to set the lifetime of the zone info to >> something relevant towards how often you and Paul usually >> update the lists. Nothing too specific is needed, just a >> general idea. Like is it daily, twice a day, every other >> day on average, etc. >> >> Also does this TXT record work for you guys: >> >> "Blocked in BigEvil. See: http://www.rulesemporium.com/" >> >> It was just a generic placeholder. I'd like >> comments/improvements on it. > How about www.rulesemporium.com/be.htm ? I can make a page just for that > error? Otherwise it is fine. Done. Please set up a page when you get a chance... :-) >> > 1) BigEvil wildcards. Not sure how you would handle these. >> Something like >> > evil\d{2,4}spam\.com is a general wildcard. Some of those >> domains don't even >> > exhist. Not sure how SURBL will handle that. >> >> Yes, I should have mentioned that I'm simply discarding them. >> Unfortunately there's no easy way to deal with them. Domains >> without any patterns in them, which are a majority, come right >> through. The script is at: > Can we make sure that when you announce this to the public that they know > this! :) > I can see the flurry of emails now. Definitely will mention the differences in the announcement and web site! >> > 3) What is the quickest way to check a domain against the >> other SURBL lists? >> > Basically I see no reason to duplicate the listings. *gulp* and on a >> > Windowze machine? (Don't ask!) >> >> I wouldn't worry too much about that for now. For now we just >> want to get an accurate record of everything. We're working on >> ways to merge things next. >> > Well ok, but I still want to look others up if I have a domain in question > :) Will there be a quick web page to look up a domain? Or do I do an > NSLOOKUP using the SURBL? You can find the domains currently going into the SURBL lists at: sc: http://spamcheck.freeapp.net/top-sites-domains ws: http://spamcheck.freeapp.net/sa-blacklist.current.domains.afterwhitelist be: http://spamcheck.freeapp.net/bigevil.domains.afterwhitelist But frankly I like the fact that there is some overlap in the lists. In a sense that represents multiple reporting; i.e. a domain in more than one list is more likely a bad guy. I don't think we should lose that coding. YMMV, but I'd say keep any overlap in BE. It's a feature not a bug. >> > 4) Has there been any talk with the sendmail people? It >> would be interesting >> > to actually block at the MTA level based on an evil URL. I >> realise the >> > inherent dangers in this ;) >> >> Yes, there is talk about sendmail milters using SURBLs. I >> haven't heard of anyone doing one yet, but they're feasible. >> The limiting factor is the FP rate. FPs must be as close to >> zero as possible before people will dare to reject spams at the >> MTA level using SURBLs, other than perhaps for personal servers, >> etc. > Dangerous, but so very fun! Hehe! ;-) Messing with spammers is always fun! Jeff C.

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RE: ANNOUNCE: Mail::SpamAsssassin::SpamCopURI 0.11
by Simon Byrnand 22 Apr '04

22 Apr '04

(I've moved this message from the SA list to the SURBL list where it's more relevant and wont get lost in the noise....) At 06:14 22/04/2004, Dallas L. Engelken wrote: > > > > > I have just released SpamCopURI version 0.11. This fixes a > > few bugs > > > that had been reported and adds open redirect resolution. > > [...] > > > >Just installed it... Can you tell me what is up with this. > >@400000004086b7c400ac051c debug: Query failed for >thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c400ad2244 debug: querying for >www.thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c400ad262c >@400000004086b7c400d251cc debug: Query failed for >www.thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c400d74b3c debug: querying for >thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c400d7530c >@400000004086b7c400f8d144 debug: Query failed for >thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c400f9ea84 debug: querying for >www.thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c400f9f254 >@400000004086b7c4011e6e2c debug: Query failed for >www.thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c40123d8e4 debug: querying for >thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c40123e0b4 >@400000004086b7c4014c5814 debug: Query failed for >thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c4014d7924 debug: querying for >www.thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c4014d7d0c >@400000004086b7c401729524 debug: Query failed for >www.thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c401777724 debug: querying for >thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c401777ef4 >@400000004086b7c401993f94 debug: Query failed for >thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c4019a648c debug: querying for >www.thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c4019a6c5c >@400000004086b7c401bec124 debug: Query failed for >www.thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org >@400000004086b7c401c3a324 debug: querying for >thegolfchannel.com.ws.surbl.org > >Like 20 some times it tried to query before it finally stopped. Does >query failed actually mean 'failed' or there was no A record found? If >I send a test from the command line on a message that contains a uri on >both lists, it works fine. > >[root@localhost service]# echo -e 'From: dallase\n\n<a >href="http://8006hosting.com">click here</A>' | spamc > ... > * 3.0 SC_URI_RBL Contains a URL listed in the SC SURBL >blocklist > * 2.5 WS_URI_RBL Contains a URL listed in the WS SURBL >blocklist > ... > >Do I need a new DNS::Resolver or is this normal behavior? I'm seeing the same thing with SpamCopURI-0.12 as well, I don't remember whether I was seeing that with 0.10 though. I've seen cases where one message is causing 20 or more lookings for the "same" dns record. I think I've worked out what is happening. Basically each different variation of a subdomain URL found in a message is causing a seperate lookup, even though the base domains that are actually being looked up are the same. For example I made a test message that looked like this: http://serbserb.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://sebserbr.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://bsertbse.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://srtnsrtn.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://nrtnsrtn.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://saerbsee.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://rtndrtsn.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://nrtndrtn.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://sdfgserg.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://bcvcvbcx.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://ergsergh.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://qwertybe.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://lphtrhtr.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://bxdfbgnf.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://ergerger.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://cbxcvbxc.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://tyjftyjt.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://awefawfe.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://awefawef.testdomain.co.nz/blah http://awefawef.testdomain.co.nz/blah Where there is a randomized subdomain in front of the actual domain. Many spams with lots of image links (ones selling printer cartridges, etc etc) effectively do this. (Each URL refers to a randomized subdomain) Each URL above generated a dns lookup for testdomain.co.nz.sc.surbl.org and co.nz.sc.surbl.org, so a total of 40 dns lookups just for the sc list. I'm also using ws and be lists too, so thats a total of 120 dns lookups generated by an email with 20 randomized URLs :( Luckily local dns caching largely offsets the problem but it would be good to avoid in the first place. Somehow as each URL is stripped down, a list of stripped names needs to be created with duplicates removed before doing the DNS queries.... extra coding I guess... Regards, Simon

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First attempt to subvert surbl approach ? :)
by Simon Byrnand 22 Apr '04

22 Apr '04

Just browsing through my spam folder and noticed a spam with the following URL: http://yahoo.com.collectiza.com-munged/vp9 (without the -munged of course) Looks like they might think that putting yahoo.com on the front will fool a simple parser ? :) Have we been "noticed" already or am I just being paranoid ;) That particular spam didn't match on that test, but did match on another different URL in the same message... Regards, Simon

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[Fwd: Re: [SURBL-Discuss] First attempt to subvert surbl approach ? :)]
by David Coulson 22 Apr '04

22 Apr '04

There's the problem - Sticking -munged doesn't help, since it just yanks the domain right out of the middle. -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [SURBL-Discuss] First attempt to subvert surbl approach ? :) Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 17:58:44 -0700 From: Jeff Chan <jeffc(a)surbl.org> To: discuss(a)lists.surbl.org Spam detection software, running on the system "umlcoop", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or block similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: On Wednesday, April 21, 2004, 5:30:37 PM, Simon Byrnand wrote: > Just browsing through my spam folder and noticed a spam with the following URL: > http://yahoo-MUNGED.com-EVEN-MORE.collectiza.com-munged/vp9 [...] Content analysis details: (8.8 points, 6.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.8 RATWR9_MESSID Message-ID has ratware pattern (9999.99999999@) 3.0 WS_URI_RBL URI's domain appears in spamcop database at ws.surbl.org [yahoo-MUNGED.com-EVEN-MORE.collectiza.com is] [blacklisted in SpamCop RBL at ws.surbl.org] 5.0 SC_URI_RBL URI's domain appears in spamcop database at sc.surbl.org [yahoo-MUNGED.com-EVEN-MORE.collectiza.com is] [blacklisted in SpamCop RBL at sc.surbl.org]

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ccTLDs and multiple queries
by Eric Kolve 22 Apr '04

22 Apr '04

Initially, when I released spamcopuri I decided to pretty much ignore whether the TLD was a country code or not. This results in about twice as many queries as necessary, but guaranteed you would get hits if the domain was listed. Now that people are pointing this to other RBL's beside just surbl, should we continue to do second and third level queries? Or just the query that we assume to be necessary? My concern is that not all RBLs will process the domains according to a list such as http://www.bestregistrar.com/help/ccTLD.htm. I suppose the worst case scenario is we end up getting a miss when we should be getting a hit because one side presumes that say TLD .za has a subdomain 'foo', when the server doesn't. The server side would expect a second level, while the client would do a third level query (this is why I wanted the wildcard records). I guess this really isn't that great a consequence considering the savings and the fact that this shouldn't occur very often. I will go ahead and make this change if everyone is comfortable with the known risk. thanks, --eric

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Using Mulitple zones
by Doc Schneider 21 Apr '04

21 Apr '04

Got a question. How is the best way to use all the surbl.org zone with SA? uri SPAMCOP_URI_RBL eval:check_spamcop_uri_rbl('sc.surbl.org','127.0.0.2') describe SPAMCOP_URI_RBL URI's domain appears in spamcop database at sc.surbl.org tflags SPAMCOP_URI_RBL net score SPAMCOP_URI_RBL 3.0 uri SPAMCOP_URI_RBL eval:check_spamcop_uri_rbl('be.surbl.org','127.0.0.2') describe SPAMCOP_URI_RBL URI's domain appears in spamcop database at be.surbl.org tflags SPAMCOP_URI_RBL net score SPAMCOP_URI_RBL 3.0 uri SPAMCOP_URI_RBL eval:check_spamcop_uri_rbl('ws.surbl.org','127.0.0.2') describe SPAMCOP_URI_RBL URI's domain appears in spamcop database at ws.surbl.org tflags SPAMCOP_URI_RBL net score SPAMCOP_URI_RBL 3.0 Or do I need to change something? I just have it now doing the sc zones, but would like to have it parse through them all. Thanks, -- -Doc --- MomNDoc Online Consultants http://www.maddoc.net/ momndoc(a)maddoc.net

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RE: [SURBL-Discuss] BigEvil + MidEvil as SURBL
by Chris Santerre 21 Apr '04

21 Apr '04

> -----Original Message----- > From: Jeff Chan [mailto:jeffc@surbl.org] > Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 9:54 AM > To: Chris Santerre > Cc: SURBL Discussion list > Subject: Re: [SURBL-Discuss] BigEvil + MidEvil as SURBL > > > > 2) Where would I send updates? As single domains, or a txt > list? How would I > > remove an FP? > > In case it's not clear, FPs will come out of be.surbl.org > automatically when they come out of bigevil.cf and midevil.cf. > > If you need to manually whitelist a domain, just send a message > to us at whitelist at surbl dot org and we'll do that ASAP. > > Jeff C. Now that I see how you are doing this, let me just reiterate....FREAKIN KEWL!!! Well then, I see what I have to do with Paul. And This is so so very cool! --Chris

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